How much would you pay for a PC with 128KB RAM, and no hard disk?
In today’s money (inflation adjusted)
This an ad from Personal Computer World (UK) from 1985
There was some commercial for the Commodore 64 which basically lambasted the IBM PC for being twice as expensive while having the the same 64K memory.
I was, like, “yeah, but nobody ever bought the 64K model of IBM PC. That would have been just ridiculously limited, right? Right? Everyone got memory expansions, surely?”
Well, 64K was the stock configuration, so I’m sure those memory expansions sold like hotcakes. There was even the option for freaking 16K memory. (Now, I’m sure next to nobody bought that.) Even option to getting no floppy drives, because you could always put your glorious BASIC programs on a cassette tape. Like a caveman. (This also sounds like a rare option.)
@umbraroze C64 caveman with datasette drive reporting in o7
The IBM was Expandable to 640k, which Bill famously said “would be enough for anyone”!!
Fun fact, he never actually said that. Maybe Al Gore did when he invented the internet…
We had a PCjr. Default was 64k, but we got the 64k sidecar add on for a whopping 128 kb of RAM. We also got a Hayes Smartmodem 1200 with the aluminum case and red LEDs that I still have, because it’s amazing even though it’s useless. Dad would use it to connect to Compuserv.
We never had the Chiclet keyboard, though - I think they were on to regular keyboards by the time we bought ours.
Was Olivetti any good at that time?
The conversion is wrong. £1500 in 1985 is £5814.92($7,359.45) today.
I just googled the conversion of the price from 1985 to today based on inflation and then googled the exchange rate between the current value in GBP to USD.
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Hey, I recognize you from this comment! You flipped that switch so many decades ago, ruining everything I had worked so hard for. I’ll always remember.
Those lost 50KB of work will forever be etched into my mind. Quite literally: the second I get my hands on a 30TB neurolink you bet your goddam ass I’m making a 50KB text file with your name on repeat, so that I’ll always hear your name echo in my thoughts. “u/Kalkaline@programming.dev flipped my surge protector’s switch”, for x in range infinity
I remember my dad paying $800 for 8 megabytes of RAM.
Shit was expensive back then
8 megabytes? I remember upgrading my Apple IIe with a 64k expansion card which allowed for 80 columns of text characters.
It was at least $125.
I was quoted £450 for 16MB in 1993. Approximately double that now with inflation. I was a 15 year old with a part time paper route, no way I’d ever afford that!
Psh, $5700 and they don’t even come with a 4090.
Seriously, though, it’s no wonder why businesses had most of computers in the 80s; these companies were ripping people the hell off and getting away with it. Nearly $6 grand and you don’t even get a hard drive, nor a reasonable amount of RAM. Give me a fucking break.
I used 3 of those. That Compaq was about as “portable” as a suitcase stuffed with a corpse. Great machine though when you needed it!
I miss the green and black screen though.
So everything is about right. Today you can buy a budget pc, and skim on performance, but back then (and I was there man!) you could not.
In 1985 HDD were only starting to gain traction for PC’s and that was about the only thing you could spec up. That IBM pc is “High Res” which probably means it was VGA multicolour (yay!lol) with 640x480 resolution. So you were basically buying top of the line.
Today, if you were to build a top of the line PC, RTX4090, latest best intel cpu, PSU, etc, etc it would be easy to spend $5K!
But damn, the difference in performance from back then to now!! (That IBM is an XT which means it was a 4.77Mhz with 8086 cpu. Just looking at that picture, I can feel the weight of the bloody thing)
I was there too but vga was not. My dad got an IBM XT fully specd as a home computer (he was CFO of Emma EDB). I believe the hires could be EGA or probably Hercules as they don’t brag about colours - but his had CGA. The full spec of my dads pc - that changed my life - was: 2x256kb ram on full length isa cards. 10mb hdd, 360kb floppy. 9pin printer and cga. Total cost back then in Norwegian KR was 120000.
Might be right, could have been ega. It was a long time ago and the mind is wobbly.
yea 8086 couldn’t drive a vga. 16 preset ugly colors if you’re lucky. unless you had a magical amiga with dedicated graphics chips to do 256 colors, 4096 if you’re nasty.
Sir, I’ll have you know that I had an IBM PS/2 Model 25 with 256 glorious colors in MCGA. And fuck every developer that didn’t support MCGA, because it dropped down to 4 color CGA if not. No support for EGA.
Oh those raster hacks and stuff…
After checking with my dad the price was half of what I stated. He got one for home and one for office - the business he was with was providing IBM mainframes, and wanted to check out the PC. My dad got them because of Lotus 1-2-3 - spreadsheets was the shit in accounting/ finance already
Adjusted for inflation, I’m pretty sure that today’s PCs are still cheaper than this.
Also, these PCs back then were heavy (=>much more resource intensive), handbuilt and low-volume. All things that add a lot to the price.
I don’t know about resource intensive, today you need a frigging powerplant to feed a decent PC. At least the 286 and onwards didn’t consume that much right?
Edit: It was not about running costs but the resources to Build them, and that’s true for sure! Sorry!
I think they mean resource intensive as in it literally took more physical material to build them, which costs more.
Ah okay, that’s totally true.
Resource intensive to make. If you have a PC that consists of 20kg steel and other materials, that’s gonna add to the price.
True true!
Today you can buy a budget pc, and skim on performance, but back then (and I was there man!) you could not.
For PCs? Maybe not, but you could get plenty of other types of home computer for reasonably cheap. A Commodore 64 was $150 in 1985, for instance. Just had to stay away from the absolute bleeding edge.
eh. Money is worth a third of what it was worth.
Two years later you could get an Amiga 500, with 512KB for £499. They were such a deal when they arrived. I bought a 20MB hard drive, an extra 512KB of RAM, a second floppy drive and a monitor. If I recall correctly that set me back around £1400.
It’s crazy how Computers have changed over the years !
I guess people who have used PC’s from the old era would be able to appreciate the current Computers in a completely different level.
When I remember back to the early 80s, me a single digit aged human with my first Commodore 64 and a cassette tape drive, to being a high school aged kid and helping my buddies install their extended memory set chip by chip to get them to 1mb of ram, to way in the future where I type this comment on a mobile phone touch screen capable of unfathomable high resolution graphics and speed is still a surreal feeling.
I grew up and grew old with computers and it’s wild to imagine a life without and a world without them nearly 50 years later.
The old computers from my childhood still boots faster than any modern OS 😎
A computer with a spreadsheet was a HUGE game changer.
In '85 most companies did books by hand and adding machine. Records were kept in ledgers and in filing cabinets. People used to hire CPA’s to come in and do the balancing even in small convenience stores. Given labor wasn’t what it is now, but a machine like that could pay for itself pretty quickly.
I worked a fast food job in the 90’s They had an ancient box running 1-2-3. Every night, the MOD would have to sit down with a paper sheet and an adding machine to generate this table, then enter all the transformed data into Lotus. They literally sat back there for hours working over the data. I asked, why don’t you just change the sheet to do all the calculations? Can’t, the franchise owner wants it all done by hand. They were literally taking a row of numbers, doing some math on it, then doing more math on each column to come up with a final row of like 7 numbers.
I had them show me what they were doing and wrote a program on my TI calculator to generate the table from the input numbers. Told them if they wanted the program just to get the same calculator and I’d transfer it over.
Nobody trusted computers… they were ‘new’. It wasn’t entirely unheard of for people to verify the output of a computer by hand, or as in your case, doing it by hand intentionally.
Apple is the second cheapest option. Damn, times have changed, for sure.
And to add it was the most advanced device compared to the others. Full mouse support, graphical interface, WYSIWYG , it was a true gamechanger.
Had a used one myself and soldered RAM chips on the MB to make it a fat Mac with 4MB RAM . Boot disk system was copied to a RAM disk after boot. Good times
It says it has a “high res monitor”. For having learned to program graphics on this machine, we had to count the pixels to be able to fit our drawings in the screen: 512x342, that’s not a lot of screen real estate. The 640x480 PC screen was a luxury.
And today that’s an icon.
This is why the ZX Spectrum was so important, in 1982 it cost £125 for the 16K model (£469 or so now). That’s within the reach of many consumers. Sure, it was laughably simplistic even at launch, but if it wasn’t for the Speccy I wouldn’t be an IT professional today.
So true! My parents got me the C64 when I had no idea about computers. I loved the Spectrum+ my buddy had at the time but always wanted the C128 another friend of mine got. My parents eventually upgraded my computer to an Amstrad CPC6128 when they saw that I was actually programming in BASIC. I learned a lot from that computer too, e.g. Fortran, Pascal, a bit of Z80 assemly (the last one was horrible!)
My Dragon 32 or 64 (can’t remember which it was) has a lot to answer for too!
Whole bunch of low cost 8-bit machines in that era, the Dragon 32, Commodore 64 and Amstrad CPC ranges to name but a few. Of course we must also mention the BBC Micro, was not low cost but every school had one if you grew up in the UK.
We had one in my school in Ireland too (and I think they were common in schools here) but tbh none of the teachers knew how to use it and so we got very little time on it in school.
Hey ZX-81 gang here!
999SKR (Swedish crowns) guess it was like 100$ and it gave you a 1KB 1Mhz computer :-) around 400SKR more for an expansion card with a whopping 16KB…
Went the C64 way but damn that Spectrum was sexy back in the day.
ZX81 here too! Bought 500FF in 1981 iirc, in kit.
Clavier membrane team !
BTW did you solder it yourself?
My father did, I was 10. But he then teached me a lot of things like soldering, programming in basic and Z80 assembly
Excellent!
Interestingly mac is the only one with a mouse.
Apple was a very different company back then. If they had followed the philosophy they have today, Apple would have been the last company to to introduce a mouse. The idea is that if a new feature becoms industry standard, they won’t apply it until like 5 years later, but make it somehow better than anyone else.
In this context, it would have probably meant not including a keyboard or display at this point. They could have skipped the black+green stage and go straight for color displays while increasing the resolution, size and refresh rate or something.
Waiting 5 years wasn’t really an option back in those days. PCs moved so fast that if you waited 5 years you’d be missing whole use cases.
Now if you wait 5 years, there’s hardly a difference.
Not very surprising considering their inspiration from xerox parc. I bought a mouse in 86 for my dads pc - a 3 button Genius. On PC mouse would not take off until windows was launched - gui was not needed for real business use according to IBM
That mouse was so uncomfortable. It was built like a box, probably designed for a robot hand.
Yep - but it was the only one available in my area of Norway at the time (I got mine for under 500 NOK because the supplier did wrong. As I was just a kid he let it slide and I got to keep it. There was some painting software supplied as well. That guy went on to be one of Norways biggest producers of pc’s - REC computers
i’m surprised nobody is mentioning that the keyboards in these were masterpieces that are so valuable today.
We had an Apple II+, IIe and //c. I would inherit each one when my family upgraded. They were around $1300 each I think. The //c might have been more because it was “portable” (you could put it in a suitcase with a 10-pound battery and a weird tiny horizontal screen that wouldn’t work with most software).
My grandparents had a C-64 which they never used. It basically became mine. I think it was $600.
My dad got the Apple ]|[ (3) he even got a whopping external 1 MB HDD for the thing. The HDD was in the same case as the CPU, so it kinda looked like my dad had two computers sitting next to each other with the monitor straddling them
Someone donated one of those to my elementary school, but we had not software for it, just an Apple II emulator that had to be loaded on the floppy drive before loading whatever other software you wanted to run on it. Sort of pointless. I’m not sure why it was donated without software other than an emulator.
Owned a //c that was all mine, a birthday gift IIRC. I remember that it had a composite output so you could plug it into a TV to play games on a bigger screen that actually had colour. Loved that thing, including the monochrome (green) monitor that neatly sat on top of it. I would spend hours typing in programs from magazines.
